Dogs used for Experimental ReasonsHas anyone seen the news lately? I just saw something about Bill Bodenweber the Director of Clay County Code Enforcement, who also oversees CCAC, is under investigation for using a dog to do some type of experiment to see if the dog would die the same way another dog did while in CCAC custody. What kind of person would subject an animal to this kind of torture just to prove a point, or to keep from being sued by the animal owner? I think he or anyone else that was involved with this experiment and torture should be arrested. Isn't there a law that says you cannot use animals for experimental reasons?
Submitted by TruthHurts on Thu, 10/09/2008 - 7:42am.
It's my understanding the dog was used to see how the body heat of the dog effected the inside temperature of the dog box. The dog was continually monitored and was not in any danger. The dog was not put in the dog box to see if it would die or not, this is a spun lie. The dog was not tortured, this is also a spun lie. If a dog being placed in a dog box for an hour with ventilation and fans on is torture then every animal control officer in the country is guilty of torture. Ludicrous ? Yes. No animal cruelty was committed against this dog, or the dog that died recently. After reading the necropsy report for the dog that died and talking to some people in the know concerning animal conditions, captures, and health. I am under the firm beleif that the dog that died on the truck recently died from a condition called "Capture Myopathy"
TRUTHHURTS Please go to http://www.fairtax.org/site/PageServer and sign the petition for the Fair Tax Bill. Tell Congress to pass this Bill. Submitted by OneMann on Thu, 10/09/2008 - 8:16am.
As someone who looks forward to each new episode of "House," capture myopathy seems like a logical diagnosis. But it wasn't cited as the cause in the necropsy, which, ultimately, renders everything else just theory. Though I don't know him, I seriously doubt Bill Bodenweber is an absolute, total idiot or completely absent the part of humanity that makes most animal torture repulsive to most. The unwitting volunteer canine was monitored throughout the test. Though uncomfortable, it hardly seems like torture, but rather the measurement of a common practice in the transportation of Clay County animals. The method of testing and the value and legitimacy of the information gained from the test may be useful for general education purposes. As applicable to the specific investigation, it's clearly debatable because, as Angela pointed out, it wasn't an accurate recreation of the incident. Michael S. Mann
Submitted by lilyslore on Thu, 10/09/2008 - 9:17am.
My area of expertise all of my adult life was research and development in chemistry. That being said, I will not venture any teory on biological experiments per se but in the method of experimentation which crosses all aspects of scientific enquiry which is known as "scientific method". I agree with Onemann's assessment. I am certain Mr. Bodenweber is neither an absolute idiot nor a cruel human being. I do agree that while he was motivated by circumstances, Angela is also correct in that Mr. Bodenweber failed to understand and use the "scientific method", something that has been around for hundreds of years. Thankfully, there will be no long term harm to the animal in question. I would suggest, however, that the people in animal control refrain from carrying out any experiments on the fur enhanced among us. It is poor judgement to do so. Lily's Lore "I don't ever want to be rescued And I don't ever want to be saved I got a feelin' that I'm gonna be alive forever Dancin' on the edge of a grave..." Jim Steinman
Submitted by finder on Thu, 10/09/2008 - 2:45pm.
Header from CNN 'Top U.S. Stories' PETA accuses abuse by animal shelter The link to the story on WJXT http://www.news4jax.com/news/17671164/detail.html It would seem that CCAC has become, if not world famous, at least US famous. Or would that be infamous. I guess that would be a matter of oppinion. It seems as if PETA may not be too happy with our scientists at CCAC. Political advertisement paid for and approved by, Mike Heemer, write-in, for Commission Chair. Submitted by Foxx on Thu, 10/09/2008 - 3:42pm.
Heck, why not use a child an infant. they can't talk or express themselves and are virtually helpless just like a dog. Put an infant into a car with the windows cracked on a Mid 80's day. This would determine just how long one could leave the child in the car without leaving an impact on the future, this idea is nuts and so is the idea of doing it a dog for experimental purposes. How dumb do you have to be to not know the eventual outcome. I hope PETA files suit against the CCAC, it's time for another wake up call and new leadership. Submitted by Critical on Thu, 10/09/2008 - 5:29pm.
How were they monitoring him? Did they have him hooked up to a monitor that recorded heartrate, respirations, temperature, etc? Or were they merely watching him? While I am unsure that I consider this to be animal cruelty, it without a doubt demonstrates a troubling lack of judgement. CCAC for sure did not need this publicity. I think it is time for a change...
Submitted by TruthHurts on Thu, 10/09/2008 - 7:44pm.
This is getting way out of control and silly. First of all they did not put the dog inside to see if it would die as indicated. They did not torture the dog. What the story does not say is the dog was in the dog box with full ventilation and the fans on. Being in that dog box for an hour is cooler then your dog sitting in it's dog house for an hour in full sun in your back yard. To compare this with an infant in a car in full sun with a window cracked is ludicrous, you don't have full ventilation and you don't have fans on, and it's an infant human being. I would'nt leave an infant in a car with the ac on either. When those officers are making their rounds and answering calls and picking up animals, those animals almost daily are on those trucks for well over an hour. All they were doing was checking to see how the dogs body heat effected the temperature inside the box. The dog was never in any danger. This is being spun way out of proportion and is being made out to be something it is not. It does not take a rocket sceintist to figure out who is behind the spin either.
TRUTHHURTS Please go to http://www.fairtax.org/site/PageServer and sign the petition for the Fair Tax Bill. Tell Congress to pass this Bill.
Submitted by kilroy on Thu, 10/09/2008 - 7:53pm.
I'd like to know who "coined" this an "experiment". Every day dogs and cats and wildlife are placed in these boxes. Not in a van. Not inside the cab with the windows cracked. They are literally boxes made of fiberglass with louver doors. CCAC has never had a healthy dog die during transit. Thousands of animals have been transported in the same manner, as a matter or fact, up until 2005 the boxes did not even have ventilation fans. If CCAC had ignored this and did nothing you would complain and blame management for doing nothing. The boxes do not come with thermostats installed. CCAC management has requested air-conditioned boxes in the past and the response was something like this "them dogs don't need no air conditioning" These boxes are always cooler than the air temperature when they are empty. If CCAC can prove that once an animal is contained inside of the box the temperature rises then maybe CCAC can prove that "them dogs" do need air-conditioned boxes. I will tell all of you this and all of you are welcome to come and witness it. I will put my own dog in one of these boxes and monitor him in the same manner if that what it takes to prove that air-conditioned boxes are needed. A/C in dog boxes cost $$$$, not just to purchase but to maintain. They also can create a false sense of security. Along with the A/C temperature alarms must be installed to alert the driver if the temperature rises. The best part of air-conditioned boxes is the public perception...They see a government that cares about the well being of animals. Please go to:
Submitted by kilroy on Thu, 10/09/2008 - 8:06pm.
Let me re-phrase this: I will tell all of you this and you all are welcome to come and witness it. I will put my own dog in one of these boxes (again) and monitor him in the same manner if that what it takes to prove that air-conditioned boxes are needed. The re-phrase is (again), he has already had the pleasure of riding in one of these boxes being that I adopted him from CCAC 6 years ago. Please go to: Submitted by suziehomemaker on Thu, 10/09/2008 - 8:12pm.
Check the channel 4 website for the report its there.
Submitted by TruthHurts on Thu, 10/09/2008 - 8:24pm.
Channel 4 knows only what the nice people (and we know who they are) have told them. Notice channel 4 does not mention full ventilation and fans on, just to start. We all know who is behind this. Any Baby Huey can call the news and PETA. They are just thrilled to get the next sensational story. It's a joke
TRUTHHURTS Please go to http://www.fairtax.org/site/PageServer and sign the petition for the Fair Tax Bill. Tell Congress to pass this Bill.
Submitted by discontented on Thu, 10/09/2008 - 8:29pm.
Here we go again,,,,,how is everyone tonight. me- sick as a dog. no pun intended.
Submitted by TruthHurts on Thu, 10/09/2008 - 8:34pm.
Yes same ol same. Sorry you're feeling sick. hope you feel better and get well soon.
TRUTHHURTS Please go to http://www.fairtax.org/site/PageServer and sign the petition for the Fair Tax Bill. Tell Congress to pass this Bill.
Submitted by discontented on Thu, 10/09/2008 - 8:35pm.
i have taken every cold medicine known to man , nothing is helping ...any home remedies that might work?
Submitted by TruthHurts on Thu, 10/09/2008 - 8:38pm.
I like to hug my favorite teddy bear friend
TRUTHHURTS Please go to http://www.fairtax.org/site/PageServer and sign the petition for the Fair Tax Bill. Tell Congress to pass this Bill.
Submitted by kilroy on Thu, 10/09/2008 - 8:59pm.
Submitted by suziehomemaker on Thu, 10/09/2008 - 8:59pm.
I sure wish you all cared as much for the animals as you do for each other...how sweet!!!
Submitted by kilroy on Thu, 10/09/2008 - 9:02pm.
TH: You give Mr. Rammon too much credit. Like all theatrics the master minds are always hiding behind the curtains. Please go to:
Submitted by discontented on Thu, 10/09/2008 - 9:06pm.
That sounds divine.....the brandy that is,,,,,,,
Submitted by kilroy on Thu, 10/09/2008 - 9:18pm.
Define caring for animals please. Could it be waking up at 3 AM to pick the hit by a car animal up and transport it to the vet so it can be humanely euthanized? Could it be waking up early Christmas Day morning to clean and feed the animals that nobody else gives a hoot about? Could it be picking up a dog that is acting aggressive so CCSO doesn't shoot it? Please go to: Submitted by suziehomemaker on Thu, 10/09/2008 - 9:30pm.
I certainly hope that you read the job description before you applied for a position working with animals, no one said it would be easy, appreciated, or glorified. I would think its rewarding for you to know your trying to make a difference, especially when you look into their faces and realize that they know you are there to help them!! Sorry, but I have little ones to put to bed...Goodnight
Submitted by kilroy on Thu, 10/09/2008 - 9:36pm.
Suzie: You brought a tear to my eye. I don't need you to tell me what my expectations were or are. I've looked into the eyes of more suffering animals than I care to remember. Unlike you, I actually do care for the unwanted and neglected animals. I don't just sit in front of a computer spreading hate and discontent. Please go to:
Submitted by kilroy on Thu, 10/09/2008 - 9:40pm.
Honestly, it works. I don't know how or why, but whenever I get a cold that nyquil can't control, a glass of Blackberry Brandy in the evening helps. I always have to change the bedsheets at least once during the night. It's like the Brandy sweats it out of me. Brainstorm, maybe I could get suziehomemaker to change the sheets for me Please go to: Submitted by NOBULL on Thu, 10/09/2008 - 9:46pm.
To Kilroy, Truth Hurts and the rest of the ccac employees who are constantly on this blog trying to protect your jobs, we are all tired of your lies, by now we all know your stupid but are you blind too, do yourselves a favor get a little educated and read your boss's reports, they will enlighten you. And by the way one of the first things you do since you are all so small minded is call names, but I have seen you all and boy if I were you I would not be commenting on anyones appearance you all have no room to talk.
Submitted by TruthHurts on Thu, 10/09/2008 - 9:54pm.
NOBULL you must be equally small minded, you just called folks stupid. The pot calling the kettle black. NOBULL=FULLBULL Get your facts straight and stop your spin. No crime was committed here. The dog was placed on an animal control truck in the box with full ventilation and fans. They put the dog on a truck designed to carry animals, and the type that is used all over the country. If your logic was correct every animal control officer across the nation that places a dog on their dog truck is guilty of a crime. You are being ludicrous. They did not put the dog on the truck to see if it would kill the dog, that's just dumb to say. The dog was never in any danger, was not harmed, and was monitored all the time. You are being a spinning fool. You are somehow connected to the same group of people with the same personal hateful agenda.
TRUTHHURTS Please go to http://www.fairtax.org/site/PageServer and sign the petition for the Fair Tax Bill. Tell Congress to pass this Bill.
Submitted by kilroy on Thu, 10/09/2008 - 9:57pm.
We know, we've all seen you. DUH What year is that van, 1980 something, I bet you get real good gas milage too. Maybe thats why you're (you are) always parked on the side of the road. Please go to: Submitted by NOBULL on Thu, 10/09/2008 - 10:08pm.
Still trying to prove how stupid you really are, We get it already no more proof needed, Maybe if I still worked at ccac I could get a new corvette. Rumor has it there will be some terminations soon, get those resumes ready, be sure and list your past employment at McDonalds. Submitted by NOBULL on Thu, 10/09/2008 - 10:21pm.
Sounds like your running scared, still coming up with excuse after excuse after excuse and then you lie You ccac employees have become expert liars. Story tellers too, after all we all know you don't do your jobs, you have plenty of time to compare lies and try to keep your stories straight. After a while it will catch up with you. And just because I am not a ccac employee, and I am thankful for that, it does not make me a part of any other group, I am an independent, I have been where you are and know what your doing,
Submitted by kilroy on Thu, 10/09/2008 - 10:22pm.
Thank You. I will no longer respond to you. Please go to:
Submitted by TruthHurts on Thu, 10/09/2008 - 10:24pm.
Look this is why you get called stupid ok. Stop and use your simple mind for a minute and stop wasting everyones time. This was nothing more then checking to see how an animals body heat effects the temperature inside the box. These are the very dog boxes that animals get placed in every day all over the nation and in most cases these animals are inside these boxes well over an hour. These boxes have full ventilation and had the fans on. The test or experiment or whatever you want to call it was not on the dog, it was on the dog box temperature while an animal was inside it, as is the normal protocal all across the nation. this is not torture, and they were not waiting to see if the dog would die. This is your spin, your lies. Everyone knows your agenda everyone knows what you have been doing. You are sensationalising none issues in an effort to make something out of nothing. Getting media and anyone else you can like PETA to get involved and you are wasting all their time. You are an idiot in my opinion. TRUTHHURTS Please go to http://www.fairtax.org/site/PageServer and sign the petition for the Fair Tax Bill. Tell Congress to pass this Bill. Submitted by NOBULL on Thu, 10/09/2008 - 10:29pm.
Come on you know we I am part if the ex-list, I think someone at ccac called me a mole, or something like that, just because I took great pictures and so many good notes. Come on don't go away mad, but we'll all understabnd if you need time to update your resume too. Submitted by NOBULL on Thu, 10/09/2008 - 10:32pm.
Keep it up soon you will believe your own lies. Come on with a name like truth hurts you can't handle the truth,
Submitted by TruthHurts on Thu, 10/09/2008 - 10:37pm.
Oh I am not mad......and trust me I am not going away. As far as moles go I think you need a new one because so far you can't seem to come up with anything acurate or truthful TRUTHHURTS Please go to http://www.fairtax.org/site/PageServer and sign the petition for the Fair Tax Bill. Tell Congress to pass this Bill. Submitted by NOBULL on Thu, 10/09/2008 - 10:42pm.
Hay, Truth Hurts, Kilroy, Maggie, and all they rest of you non working ccac employees lets meet at the picnic table at 4:00 for a smoke, or???? whatever. Now don't disobey the queen or you may not have those cushy jobs for much longer.
Submitted by TruthHurts on Thu, 10/09/2008 - 10:44pm.
I'll meet and mediate anytime you like Don just come with the truth. If you spin and lie I will hold you to task
TRUTHHURTS Please go to http://www.fairtax.org/site/PageServer and sign the petition for the Fair Tax Bill. Tell Congress to pass this Bill.
Submitted by TruthHurts on Thu, 10/09/2008 - 10:45pm.
So Don Who are you claiming is responsible for this cruel test, Bill or Mrs. Goon? Do you have a good lawyer for your up and comming deposition ? Are you sure your mole is not aleady known and being filled with disinformation to out you every time you come on here ? And finally you are not as smart as you and your buds think you are. You are only legends in your own minds. TRUTHHURTS Please go to http://www.fairtax.org/site/PageServer and sign the petition for the Fair Tax Bill. Tell Congress to pass this Bill. Submitted by NOBULL on Thu, 10/09/2008 - 10:49pm.
Oh Boy there you go making me feel bad, did I hurt your feelings. Oh by the way I did not state any facts just asked you to read your boss's report. So go ahead I dare you read it. Your such a cry baby, All you do is whine.
Submitted by TruthHurts on Thu, 10/09/2008 - 10:53pm.
You make yourself feel bad Don, You have strong defeatest, self distructive tendencies in my opinion. Not crying.....not beleiving your trash either. as I said I will hold you to task everytime. So when we having this meeting ?? It was your idea....you talk the talk, now walk the walk ? TRUTHHURTS Please go to http://www.fairtax.org/site/PageServer and sign the petition for the Fair Tax Bill. Tell Congress to pass this Bill. Submitted by NOBULL on Thu, 10/09/2008 - 11:05pm.
Calling names again, I am not a guy, we have met, and will continue to meet at that same old picnic table, I won't tell you who I am, that's what a blog is all about. Get over yourself already, we have,
Submitted by TruthHurts on Thu, 10/09/2008 - 11:06pm.
Look you wanted a meeting lets go for it I will be happy to mediate. It was your idea. You call Mrs, Goon and Mr. Bodenweber and get your pal Det. Henderson. and I will meet you all anytime to mediate and work through this if thats what it takes to end this ludicrous andventure. Put up or shut up, it was your idea.
TRUTHHURTS Please go to http://www.fairtax.org/site/PageServer and sign the petition for the Fair Tax Bill. Tell Congress to pass this Bill.
Submitted by kilroy on Fri, 10/10/2008 - 1:29am.
I had to wait till the trouble makers went night night. Capture Myopathy is fear induced and can affect domestic animals although it mostly affects wildlife. The Necropsy results are inconclusive. I'm sure that "Dr. House" would raise an eyebrow in suspicion. http://www.unbc.ca/nlui/wildlife_diseases_bc/exertional_myopathy.htm
http://www.diaa.org/captmyop.htm Please go to:
Submitted by TruthHurts on Fri, 10/10/2008 - 5:33pm.
It happens in ALL animals go ask your vet friends. It is more common in birds and wildlife yes, but it can also happen to an over excited dog that has been running around too. It can happen to ALL animals. and if you knew anything about animals you would know this. More Spin TRUTHHURTS Please go to http://www.fairtax.org/site/PageServer and sign the petition for the Fair Tax Bill. Tell Congress to pass this Bill. Submitted by suziehomemaker on Fri, 10/10/2008 - 5:34pm.
Funny...I didn't read a thing that said it happens to domestic animals in your posted web site? Besides, I think if that could have been one of the indications found by the professionals at the lab when the necropsy was conducted it would have stated so. I think you need to leave the science to the professionals and stick to being a dog catcher!!!
Submitted by TruthHurts on Fri, 10/10/2008 - 5:35pm.
It happens in ALL animals go ask your vet friends. It is more common in birds and wildlife yes, but it can also happen to an over excited dog that has been running around too. It can happen to ALL animals. and if you knew anything about animals you would know this. More Spin TRUTHHURTS Please go to http://www.fairtax.org/site/PageServer and sign the petition for the Fair Tax Bill. Tell Congress to pass this Bill. Submitted by Dynacoman on Sun, 10/12/2008 - 2:11pm.
Hey Nobull.'instead of wasting your time here, try for a career upgrade and apply at Micky D's.
Submitted by joeriley08 on Sun, 10/12/2008 - 2:45pm.
Well, as I have taken a "sabbatical" from this issue and have now returned it looks like nothing has really been accomplished concerning CCAC and those that wish to discredit its leadership. Does anyone have any information on the Lawsuit against Don Rammon?
Submitted by TruthHurts on Sun, 10/12/2008 - 2:49pm.
Joe I beleive he goes in to give his deposition on the 23rd or 24th of this month
TRUTHHURTS Please go to http://www.fairtax.org/site/PageServer and sign the petition for the Fair Tax Bill. Tell Congress to pass this Bill. People are talking about ...Here are the recent blog postings with the most comments. |
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Well it would depend on certain circumstances. Now if the experiment conducted included a dog that was of the same age, size and black color. The dog was then made to be deprived of water and ran upon the roads of the county for what can be determined the amount of time the animal was unknowingly out of his yard. The temperature and the humidity were factored in the equation too. And the animal used in the experiment was obviously in distress. Then he was picked up and hauled around in a vehicle in that situation for the time determined. Then open the door to see if the dog was dead. I would call that experiement intentional animal cruelty. The law covers acts of negligence and intentional acts. If the experiment was not conducted under the same conditions as the dog that died. Then it should be of no useful purpose. It is not a accurate reenactment of the situation.
The FSS 828.12 states:
(1) A person who unnecessarily overloads, overdrives, torments, deprives of necessary sustenance or shelter, or unnecessarily mutilates, or kills any animal, or causes the same to be done, or carries in or upon any vehicle, or otherwise, any animal in a cruel or inhumane manner, is guilty of a misdemeanor of the first degree, punishable as provided in s. 775.082 or by a fine of not more than $5,000, or both.
(2) A person who intentionally commits an act to any animal which results in the cruel death, or excessive or repeated infliction of unnecessary pain or suffering, or causes the same to be done, is guilty of a felony of the third degree, punishable as provided in s. 775.082 or by a fine of not more than $10,000, or both.
There is a valid reason why the CCAC policy requires them to carrying water on their vehicles. Not to provide that water a necessary sustenance to a animal that was obviously distressed by the experience was negligent and in violation of the policy set forth by CCAC in my opinion.