Coming Out & 'Fessing Up

See a little humble pie never hurt anyone - except those afraid to partake.

Welcome back, Uncle R. I look forward to our discussions.

Key2Life = confession for the soul.

JATFK2L.

Key,

This wasn't a case of eating humble pie.  Perhaps you have missed some of the entries leading up to this.  In any case, if you re read the first sentance of my last paragraph, you'll note that I won't be actively participating in the blog any more.

RichK

It's not nice to fool Mother Nature.

Glad to have you back.  One thing I have learned here, the bloggers are pretty forgiving, and keep moving forward despite the bumps along the way.  I always look forward to your blogs and comments.  Nothing's changed - except you've revealed something to us all.  You're human.

I am sorry that we live in a world where people expressing their opinions can lead to harrassment and threats.  I can only imagine what Editors and Reporters have to put up with. 

I'm also sorry for the result of all this in the blogs, I was the one who said operating under two different names was childish but you were obviously no longer participating as RichK so in some ways that did not apply to you. 

I have mixed feelings about all this.  On one hand I feel bad for you, on the other I don't. My personal feelings are that you either stand for what you believe and take the heat or keep your comments more tempered for general consumption.  You once told us all that even though you're agnostic and you railed against religion constantly in a sports activity you "played along with praying" which was odd considering how vocal you were against religion.  I have alot of feelings and beliefs, some of them very strong that I keep out of the blogs for that very reason.  Just because I come here and talk about issues doesn't mean I am going to give my opinion on every facet of life.  I'm here looking for things to unite us, not divide us. 

This is supposed to be an adult forum, not a chat room, and despite what appear to be valid reasons for doing what you did there are stories everywhere about the dangers that result from hidden idenities on the internet.

I think you gave yourself away on more then one occassion.  You let it be known in the blogs that you'd written a letter to the Editor and what it was about.  Had you not done that the conncection between RichK and the person who wrote that letter would never have been made.  You gave yourself away with the new name because you came back blogging about the same subjects, and in the same way. For me personally it was not the behavior of someone trying to remain annonymous. My email is open, all it would have taken was an email about what was going on and I doubt anyone here would have intentionally "outted" you, I know I wouldn't have. 

I'm sorry for your troubles, sorry you won't be participating anymore, but with the lack of information had here in the blogging community I don't see how we're to blame for anything and I don't believe that we "outed" you at all, you did that yourself.   

I appreciate your confession, in any event. It still takes a great deal of humility to acknowledge anything less than perfection because people place such value on their social image (appearances).

I, too, regret you were the target of misplaced feelings from those on the right. Been there, felt that. Perhaps you'll consider leaving the door ajar in case there's something someone says that you'd like to contribute to in the future. Joe or Rich. It doesn't matter.

Marsha,

The blogs are not to blame.  Far from it.  I've had nothing but praise for these blogs & I still feel that way.  Yes, I accept the major portion of the blame for the connection with the letters to the editor.  It was stupid on my part & I can't undo that.  But I feel that if I continue to participate in the open manner that we have, I will run an unacceptable risk.  I do have other outlets.  Once again, I don't think any one participating in these blogs would stoop to the level of harassing calls.  Set your mind at ease.  Your comments came well after the ball started rolling downhill.  

I do stand behind what I say & do have the courage of my convictions.  A letter to the editor this past week should show that.  But there are other manners of expressing ones views that don't involve taking an unnecessary risk.

Incidentally, I never said that I was, "playing along with praying."  I join in the team prayer as an act of being a team player in all aspects.  In that, I'm not the only one.  Religion has nothing to do with it.

Finally, I'm not blaming the group, as such, for any outing.   As I stated, the majority of blame is mine.  On the other hand, as I said in my blog, given the same circumstances, I would not follow the same path that a few, a very few did.  I was quite specific in stating that.

Yes, I'm sorry @ this situation but I'm taking the course I feel is best for me.  I had decided to do this sooner but Jonathan, bless his heart, had the best interests of me & the blogs & gave me some options.  They didn't work.

It was fun, interesting & a great learning experience while it lasted.  But it's done, for now.  I'll keep monitoring for the reasons I gave.  There's just too much I can learn to completely ignore a venue like this.  I just won't be contributing.

I thank you for your contributions, your intellect, your honesty & manner.  It rubs off on people.  It did on me.  You go girl.  JATFUR.

RichK

You were, and will continue to be missed. If I think I see you again I will keep it to myself so you can participate in peace.   It just goes to show that you never know what people are enduring if you're not part of their inner circle, and why it's best to not rush to judgement. 

Rich -

I guess I am oblivious to the whole incident to which everyone else seems to know about, but I can't imagine why you feel you should not participate here.  I believe it is wrong to let 'them' win.  By being out, you have strengthened your hand.  If someone is threatening you and yours, call the police.  I've done it before when someone was physically threatening a family member.  A visit from the police put an end to it quickly.  Never heard another word.

Marsha, you should not feel any blame at all.  That @ sign was a clue a blind man would've picked up on, never mind the syntax and tone.

Rich - I speak for a lot of people who feel your contributions have enhanced this blog and it would be a crying shame for some gutless extremist to change how you behave.  I think that's what we're supposed to be fighting in the ME.

Bill (Baxley) Garrison

Rich or Joe or Sam or ........

It is certainly unfortunate that there are people out there that feel that the only way to get their point across is to be physical about it. It always amazes me how some who profess that they are 'True Believers" can feel that they are justified in their actions because of some perceived slight to their Lord.

I'm not as eloquent as many here but I want to pass on my thoughts of your leaving the blog world here at MCS.

I can understand your hesitation to continue participating in this community if you are being harassed by some off the wall nit wit. Please do what you feel is needed to take care of yourself and your family. I (and probably many others) will miss your input to these discussions. If in the future you feel that you can safely come back (as any name you choose of course), I would be glad to have you back.

May the 'Force' be with you. 

Finder

Key, Marsha, Bax & Finder,

Thanks for the kind words & encouragement.  Marsha, I don't really have an inner circle.  It makes life somewhat easier.  I was more concerned @ the family of bloggers.  I wanted to make sure that you all knew that I'm doing what I'm doing through no fault of anyone on the blogs.  As I alluded, it's one thing to be harassed by a person 25 or 300 miles away.  Another thing if a person who doesn't participate on the blogs disagrees with you & lives only a few miles away.  I consider myself fairly aware & prepared for most eventualities.  But no one can be 100% prepared 100% of the time.  Not even the most powerful nation on earth.

Bax, go back & read my blog above & you'll get the picture.  One harassing phone call won't mean anything to the police, even with caller ID.  It's only after a # of them will they respond.  Well, better the police reply than me.  But that's my bad side from Chicago speaking.  Bax, a hint.  Don't get hung up on the short cut signs.  Go & look back at the various blogs.  We all have used them.  Here' a good one as long as I'm 'fessing up.  # 1, I already said that I'll keep tabs on the blogs.  Great info here.  #2,If I do come back, I will use another user name. 

Yes, I'm changing, but not that much.  As I said, I have other outlets, other venues.  I usually try to have an ace up my sleeve.  Or, as the old Indian said in the movie, "The Outlaw Josey Wales," "It's good to have an edge."

Finder, the name is Rich.  Ask any one.  On "True Believers."  I've seen "True Believers" fly planes into buildings.  I've seen "True Believers" who live lavish lifestyles, contradict or pick & choose verses from scriptures because they found people gullible enough to place their faith in them.  I've seen true believers intolerant enough to bomb abortion clinics and kill innocent people in the process.  I've also seen "True Believers who do nothing more than live an honest life, live & let live, worship quietly & have a smile on their face that is genuine.  I've seen true believers who donate their time & labor at child care centers, places that care for the infirm or elderly or at a homeless shelter on the holidays.  The biggest difference I can see is that the latter two examples don't go @ proclaiming how "True," they are.  they don't ask for money.  they don't ask for recognition or accolades.  They just ask for justice & the chance to help.  Some of the people on these blogs know my views on organized religion.  I don't have much use for it.  But if there is a god, I hope that he/she is paying more attention to the last two examples & will reward them accordingly.  They deserve it, not the other ones.  I've also found these types of people on these blogs.  If I had to choose which type  to sit down & have dinner with, it would be the latter examples.

Just to set the record straight, I've only been harassed by letters I wrote to the Times Union & Miami Herald.  As far as I know, no one from the blogs has been involved.

Once again, thanks for the kind words & encouragement.  I'll keep the force with me.  JATFUR.

RichK

Jump in anytime RK-Joe or is it really Jason Bourne. 

I still think you are really taking time off to be a speech writer for Hillary.  I will be watching for your little tips from UR to slip into her speeches!

You may notice I myself lay off for a week or more at a time. 

Take care and don't go far, and if you do, be sure to keep turning right when you have a question.

Your Right Blogger Friend

CCC,

Thanks for the thoughts.  Hillary couldn't pay me enough for that job.  Besides, I don't think even I could spin that much.

RichK

I am saddened to hear of your souring experience.   The smoothest boat ride is right behind the bigger boat in front of you.  Not too far left, or too far right.  Of course you are stuck behind the boat.  Crossing the wake, or in your case, mainstream ideas, causes a rough ride for a bit, but when you cross the wake, the ride is smooth again, and you dont have to follow anyone.  The ride is never smooth out of the mainstream.

Frankly, I have stayed off the blogs because I have become bored by them.  I know who and what each of the bloggers will write about.  I guess familiarity breeds contempt.  I always admired your honesty in conveying your opinions and thoughts. I hope you will dismiss the kooks.  A telephone number change isn't that expensive!

I think many of the bloggers suffer from watching Mel Gibson's Conspiracy Theory too many times.   

I will miss your comments.

The Islander....stuck with no boat! 

Islander,

You could have been contributing all of these weeks and yet you cheated us of your insight and participation.

No guts, no glory.

Hasta la bye-bye.

Key2Life = No guts, no glory.

Dang Islander I didn't know I was that predictable or boring. I'll have to try harder.

I do like your boat analogy though. I've always liked the line from the Garth Brooks song 'The River'; -- choose to chance the rapids and dare to dance the tide--

Finder

They say that 96% of the time humans are bored, so boring isn't necessarily a bad thing. It's just boring. I mean I can look at the right hand side of the blogs and I always see the same topics. There isn't a need to beat a dead horse. It is always politics and taxes. Every now and then a new topic shows up, but, I see the same bloggers discussing the same topics day after day. Yes, I am guilty of that too. That is why I took a rest from writing blogs. I began to bore myself. My blogs blurred with the other blogs.

Yes, I agree we need a change in our county government, but I don't have the money or time to bring about that needed change by running for office.  Dark horses never win the race in reality.

Yes, I know property taxes have inequities due to the SOH amendment, but I haven't heard of a good method to equalize the unfairness. Let me restate that, I havent't heard of a method that could withstand a court challenge. The portability of the homestead exemption is just a way of eliminating the homestead exemption by using the courts.

Yes, I know that Clay county has mucked up growth management, but the people are still here, and traffic still vacuums profusely.

Yes, I know that one person can make a change, but the odds are against it!

So, someone come up with some new topics, and I will cease to use the "B" word.

From the island - bored.

The old adages and cliches are just that because they are so true.  When I said the same thing, Islander, my mother would reply rather succinctly, "Only boring people are bored". As usual, she was right. I don't see this blog as simply entertainment value for the lazy minded. I suggest you get a good book. You're helping fund libraries, use them.

Lily's Lore "I don't ever want to be rescued And I don't ever want to be saved I got a feelin' that I'm gonna be alive forever Dancin' on the edge of a grave..." Jim Steinman

Uncle Rich - I would like to say Ill miss your blogs but in reality I will not.   As stated you are agnostic and liberal.  It is my personal belief and the beliefs of my fore fathers that made this county great.  It is your belief and the beliefs of agnostic liberals that continue to destroy this country.  You opinions were oft one sided and your dislike for Christians unparalleled.  Educated yes, Intelligent no.  A blessed Thanksgiving knowing the politics you preach will no longer pollute this site.  I hope during this Christmas Season you will have time to reflect on the blessings provided to you by God!!!  Count them every day.

That is exactly what I have been doing, reading.  I guess if wanting something intellectually stimulating and not finding it in blogs is boredom, count me in every time.

 "I don't ever want to be bored And I don't ever want to be boring I got a feelin' that I'm gonna be alive forever Dancin' on the edge of boredom.  So, I am off to read a book.

You are the perfect example of why so many of us have left the church of formal religion.  You are just a meanmouthed, self-righteous and ignorant example of what so many of us see as a Jesus-freak.  You are no more following the teachings of Christ than the junk yard dog is. 

I must admit, I was not going to "bite" this time but I couldn't hold back.  It is still a free country although smunsey would have us think that it's only free to him and his ilk and the rest of us can just take a long walk off a short pier - perhaps the Shands in the future).  You are NOT a Christian, smunsey.  You are a redneck bigot and hatemonger.

Now, ClayCountyCurmudgeon, chastise me for those remarks as you did to my earlier response to this person.  Most of us are making the attempt to be civil, informative and neighborly and bloggers such as jimmaxie are out there making a difference on a daily basis.  It is sad to see this blog turning into the blogs like the ones on Jacksonville.com.

Jonathan, you told me before I registered for this MCS blog that this guy was ok.  You were wrong, I think.

You bigoted, egotistical, sanctimonious, self righteous (pick your favorite word here). Do you have any idea how many agnostic liberal non Christians gave their lives in service to this country? Better yet, do you care? Obviously you do not. Have you done anything for your country lately? By that I mean something a little more substantial than sitting on a cushioned seat on Sunday praying.

Perhaps you and your brother in Christ from over in Duval should get together. You know the one that doesn't want a white man coming in to his neighborhood? Or maybe you were good friends with the preacher that just died. You remember the one that confessed to French kissing young girls when he ran the church? Perhaps you would feel more comfortable hanging out with all the Catholic pedophiles.

People with your kind of attitude irritate and scare the crap out of me. You sound no better than the fanatics in the middle east that want to give 200 lashes to the girl that got gang raped because she broke some religious law.

A preacher I once knew was fond of saying; there are going to be enough Southern Baptists in Hell to start their own convention. Actually you could substitute any organized religion in that sentence and be right on the money. I'm pretty sure that if I end up there that I'm going to have a lot of church goers for company. But then perhaps that's why they call it hell.

I don't dislike Christians, but you and your ilk don't fit my view of what that term means. The next time you want to trash someone's opinions, speak for yourself. I for one will miss the sometimes opposing viewpoints. That to me is how you learn and grow in your ability to see that there is more than one side of the coin, and that your opinion isn't the only one and may not be the best one.

Your narrow minded attitude is what produces whack jobs that think God is telling them to blow up abortion clinics, harass people like the person that started this blog and various other acts that defy logic. Oops, sorry, logic has nothing to do with it doess it. Its called faith isn't it? That is, its faith as long as the Deity you worship has the name Jesus Christ.

Finder

Sunflower, you have saved me from "taking the bait" Last time I posted a return to smuncey I was on a tear about how he talked about liberals (which include a least one of my kids)

I believe my duty as a Christian is to lead people to Christ and the word NOT hammer them over the head and make them run the other way. I think smuncey must have a diiferent bible than me....

Oh, Sunflower you did miss one thing...add SANCTIMONIOUS right after self righteous.

finder you are faster than me....and so much better said  Bravo!

You've actually got us to stand up for what we believe and sound off to the biggoted, sanctimonius non-Christian people such as smunsey.  For eleven + years I have lived in this right-wing, conservative, narrowminded area and the only time I have ever spoken out is when Bush decided to invade a country that was doing no harm to the US and actually Sadam Hussein was only in power because Reagan, the movie star, put him there, along with Cheney, Rumsfeld, and the rest of Our Gang. 

In October of 2002, I couldn't believe those idiots in the Senate (including every Senator now running for president), voted to give a moron who has never succeeded at anything he's done in life, the go-ahead to invade a country because they were going to start selling oil for euros instead of dollars.  Look it up!  I railed about that until my friends couldn't listen to me any more and I was going to lose my job.  Yes, I caved, but no longer will I not speak out when I think I'm right. 

I didn't even know who the Dixie Chicks were until Natalie Maines spoke out about Bush. I happened to be with a group of people who worked with my husband, and one of the women said, "did you hear what they said about our president?"  I replied, "yes, I did and now I'm going to buy all of their CDs".  The next day, my sister mentioned it and I told her the same thing.  She replied "well, I don't want to talk to you about this anymore".  Fine!!

So, Rich, please don't give up.  Join me in my sometimes rants and don't be afraid.  Change your phone number, or do whatever, but please stop being afraid of harrassment.  No one ever accomplished anything by being passive.

Thanks.

Well, I will have to eat my words served up on a platter!  and I was beginning to think I was the only Democrat in Clay county!

Way to go guys!  Rich, you old dog you.....you "done went and got ever'bodies dander up!......"

so, I will eat my words...this blog is not boring anymore!

LOL.....Merry Christmas everybody....!!!!!

and the hits just keep on rollin.......

Islander - as I was trying to catch up with this blog I was thinking, "you call this boring?"  Then I got to your latest comment - it may not be the McCloughlin Group, but from time to time it does get entertaining.  Fresh blood is always welcome, and I think we all will confess to being both bored and boring from time to time.  For me, most days I find the site enlightening.  I've learned a lot, and I like to read opinions that are different than mine.  I hope you'll hang around and add to the stew we're cooking.  Why not write a blog about something different and original?  We all would love the change of pace.

smunsey - what is your objective?  If you're trying to convince us that you are narrow minded and extremist in your views, it's working.  If you are trying to demonstrate a holier-than-thou attitude, and look down your nose at the rest of us poor heathens, that's working too.  But, if you're trying to engage the rest of us in a meaningful dialogue and add something positive to our little digital community, you're failing miserably.  Are you really that mad at the rest of the world?

 have my say. Rk I will surely miss your writings. I haven’t agreed with you on many of our topics of discussion, but one thing they have always been; is thought provoking on both our parts. We have been in many heart felt and heated debates together, and have always managed too keep it civil; well almost. I can remember once or twice that I felt compelled to apologize for the stroke of my pen.

            Looking back at your blogs that you have written, you have contributed 80 different Blogs to this site. Out of that 80 only 16 had no responses, and your highest response rate was 35 responses. Rk you have been with the MCS blog site since its conception as I have, and a few other charter members that are still actively bloging. Your contribution to this site will be missed by the ones who knew you, and lost to the ones who don’t.

 I came out with my identity a few months back, with no repercussions; I gave it much thought before I did. I have mixed feelings as to whether I should have. It made me feel exposed as to the way I write so; now I write under a different pen name. Rk If your going to write under a different name, lesson # one change you writing style and get rid of @ # 2 change your topics that you write about, we know how you feel on politics and religion. If I recognize you with your knew name I will surely give you a wink.

 I truly wish you would reconsider your decision, but if not I can respect why you are doing it. I was one who recognized who you were through your letter to the editor about prayer at sporting events, but if you remember I said, should I call you RichK or call you Mr. Gr*b#$ws@i I never gave you up, but I knew who you were. Uncle Rich I hate good by’s so I will just say may you write again, and I hope I get a chance to debate you as your reincarnated self. Winn1955 will be watching and my other writer will pick up my pen. Can you guess who I am now? There is a clue in there some were.            

             It takes an unsatisfied person to make things satisfactory: winn1955

You rascally rascal you.  What's up with everyone changing masks?  I was wondering what happened to my ol' buddy winn - glad you spoke up.  Merry Christmas - to both of you.

How about ripping off one of those blood pressure raising blogs you're so good at?

Bloggers,

I cooled my jets for a week or more deeply considering my contribution to MCS. (pioneer suggested I take a sabbatical.) And I did.

And then I called pioneer and her merry band of Naysayers on the carpet for trying to gang-bang me off the blog. Which they tried to do.

They disappeared in a hurry. (To this date, we don't see them in quite the emotional prominence as they once dictated.)

And then we learn that RichK and winn1955 are bloggers who have changed their identities because we, the blogging community, have denied them open access to a cyber home where they feel comfortable in expressing their opinions.

I'd say, it sucks to be us.

RichK needs a new reality and he needs to call the Sheriff's office to report any harassment. (And no, I don't cut you any slack RichK because I've been there, done that. We can trade stories all you want.)

winn1955, I guess you want to work Clay County residents. If you're really OUT then tell us who you are. It's not obvious.

This is cool!  Now we have folks that blog that we can say they are Also Known As this or that.  I love it it's like chasing bad guys. Some of you detective bloggers guys should sign up for detective jobs at the Sheriff's Office. No telling what you may sniff out.  Oh well duty calls.

Gee, Key! Thanks for the compliment! I had no idea I was so powerful-- and "a merry band of Naysayers" under my control!

Not trying to put words in my "merry bands' " mouths, but I don't think any of them have disappeared. Maybe they just don't want to communicate on a regular basis with you for reasons they have stated on past threads.

...and it was only a week ago you were "eating humble pie" and wanting to smoke a "peace pipe".

Key2 you are way off base on the reason I chose to write under a different name. This blogging community has denied me nothing. It was my choice to take a different pen name. As I stated, I had mixed feeling in coming out, and for the exact reason that RK has stated. I took a second name because I felt exposed to the whack jobs out there that think their opinion is the only one that could be right and feel you have no right for dissent

I, winn1955 will still state my opinion when, and if I want to, but I reserve the right to use my new name with the more provocative, and controversial issue that are discussed on this site.

  I don’t know what you mean by me wanting to work Clay County residents. It obvious to me that you haven’t read the last couple of blogs that I have written, or you would know who I am.  Oh! What the hell the whack jobs couldn’t find me if they wanted to. I own nothing, and my name is not in the book. Key2 my name is Ed Winn.

      It takes an unsatisfied person to make things satisfactory: winn1955

Smuncey,

I was wondering if you were going to give me a parting shot.  I see you have & have done it in your usual, well thought, logical, fact based & eloquent manner.  Oh well.  If nothing else, consistency & predictability is your forte.

To my fellow bloggers.  I want to set your collective cyber minds at ease.  I did not interpret any of your comments aimed at smuncey as being in agreement with me or my views.  I know that many disagree with me & that's fine. 

I did not think that this situation would produce the kind of responses it did.  If I or smuncey inadvertantly pushed any boredom aside, mo better.

Sorry for the user name change/confusion.  It's a long story with which I won't bore you. 

To answer/respond to some of your comments & questions.  I too have found there to be a vast difference between this part of the country & others, especially coming from the Midwest/Northern part.  It goes back to before we were a country.  The ideas of religion & politics were formed early & in some ways have changed, but mainly stayed consistent.  I read A theory about it once.  I won't agree with it 100%, but have to admit I couldn't find anything wrong with it or anything with which I argue against.  It basically centered on climate, agriculture, property rights & religion.  Yes that's a bugaboo that's still with us.

At this point I'm not changing my phone #.  I'm not afraid of harassing calls.  Never was.  Calling the law is not going to help unless it is a threatening call or a repeating harassment.  But I am armed with the knowledge of what they can become.  Knowledge is power.

I won't give up on the topics I've written @ before.    I have three basic reasons.  First, I care about them.   Second, there are other topics that just don't hold my interest, just as with every one else having likes & dislikes.  Third, there are some topics out there, local politics being the best example, where I just don't have enough knowledge.  Even a cursury glance at the blogs will show that we have at least a half dozen people who have a tremendous in depth knowledge @ the subject.  In a situation like this, I've always tried to be long on ear & short on mouth.  I learn more that way.  Which brings me to another comment.

As many of you know, & some have taken me to task on, I'm a huge advocate in being accurate, providing sources & using facts when offering an opinion.  While I advocate the right for a person to have any opinion @ any subject, I have read, & have found out that the actual value any opinion is is diminished considerably if not accurate, or backed up by facts &/or evidence.  I'll keep adhering to that bit of wisdom.  Call me funny that way.  As you can see, I'll also keep using the typing short cuts.

I've never tried to ascertain the real idintity of any blogger.  I never had a reason.  To the best of my knowledge, I don't know any of you personally & don't recall meeting any of you who use your own names.  I value my privacy & do my best to respect that right for others.  I feel that I should repeat that the situation of harassing phone calls has nothing to do with these blogs.  It's a separate situation, but still applicable.

As I said, I will still be monitoring the blogs, especially now that they have raised the level of excitement.  Whether or not I'll be active in participating is something I'll have to think about. 

RichK/SoloVoce/joegrobowski, go ahead, take your pick. It could be fun.

Just an aside.  I have to thank smuncey for something he said that got a thought rumbling around in my head where there's plenty of room to rumble.  He said, something to the effect that it is his belief & the beliefs of his fore fathers that made this country great & that liberals & agnostics are destroying this country.  I'll leave it to all of you to review his direct quote.

Thoses comments raised my radar & made me think @ some things I read a while ago.  In his first comment, I have to agree with him 100%, but not his second.  Yes.  I'm agreeing with smuncey.  Now every one make sure that you're sitting down with something refreshing.  Consider this. 

It was the liberals who wanted to break free of Great Britain.  The conservatives wanted to stay under British rule.

After founding this great country, it was the same liberals who bothered to do the research, remembered why they came to this country in the first place, & then put into our Constitution the Establishment clause, thus ensuring that every one had the freedom to worship any god they wished or not at all without any government interference.

It was the liberals, by this document, who ensured that public taxes would not be used to favor any particular religion.

What have our current conservatives done?  They continue to impose their religion on the rest of the country & want even more.

They have taken billions of tax payers money & diverted it to one particular religion-theirs.  And they want even more.

Thanks smuncey.  If it weren't for you, I might have forgotten this little tidbit of history.  You're a heck of a guy & I'm thankful for all of your help.

RichK

I am not defending SMunsey - he is actually what I might call "challenged" and unfortunately gives us Christian conservatives a bad name.  But again, if you don't roll him into the mainstream Christians, I won't roll Michael Moore or Alec Baldwin or Rosie O'Donnel into the mainstream democrats.

I also wanted to point out something (backed by fact)

In the blog above, SMunsey did not call RK/Joe/Solo any 'names', other than confirming what he (RK/Joe/Solo) emphasizes - he is an agnostic and liberal, not exactly defamation of character or a personal attack.  Probably the worst thing was "educated yes, intelligent no."

However - in reply to SMunsey's words you see the following being called of SMunsey

Sunflower - meanmouthed, selfrighteous, ignorant, redneck bigot, hatemonger.  Sunflower went on to state, "Most of us are making attempts to be civil..."  Excuse me, but the words here are not civil.

Finder - (by the way, you have the best picture) - you used bigoted, egotistical, self-rightous and accused him of wanting to hang out with catholic pedophiles and compared him to those who bomb abortion clinics.

Now come on, that is not exactly acceptance of all or even close. 

SMunsey, for all his shortcomings, has never launched (that I recall) such personal hate-filled attacks of anybody on this blog.  He is the little dog nipping at your heels, and that is all.  And his bark is not near as hate-filled as what he receives. 

Back to the origin of this particular blog - see ya around RK/Joe/Solo and don't forget that cup of coffee somebody. 

CCC,

Yeah, you pretty much hit the nail on the head.  While I, like the rest of the bloggers, don't condone personal attacks, I can only think that the negative reaction to smuncey was because of not necessarily what he said, but how he said it.  Human nature got the better of some folks.  I won't condone it, but neither will I condemn it.  It's not like I don't have any faults & that's the name of that tune.

I'm glad to see that you still have the attitude of not lumping the extremists in with the mainstream.  I know I've stated it & my guess others have too, that one is going to have whack jobs in any group or organization.  Religion & politics are not immune. 

Coffee sounds good.

RichK

CCC - you are right.  I was wrong.  My words were uncivil.  Smunsey isn't worth the  time it took to write them.

I think the reaction to smunsey's blog was the result of almost 8 years of pent up frustration.  Yes, I am a social democrat, an economic moderate, and have conservative values.  I am sick and tired of being accused of being unpatriotic and not supporting the US troops in Iraq, when I simply disagree with our President.  I am sick and tired of loud mouths like  Hannity and Limbaugh making liberals even more dark and sinister than Islamic terrorists.  I am sick and tired of having religious values pushed at me from all directions.  I attend church, I have strong beliefs, I just don't agree with mainstream republicans most of the time.  That does not make me the evil person that I am portrayed to be. 

By all I hear, I am a dirty rotten, low-down, piece of garbage because I question the leaders and opinions of about half of our population.  I must  agree with the other 50% of our population.  Our elections show how divided we are.  It is the name calling and snide attitudes that I am sick of.  Why can't we just disagree and leave it at that.  I didn't vote for Bush, but he is my President.  I didn't agree with the invasion of Iraq, but we are there.  I don't agree with a blank check for Iraq and nothing for our own country but vetoes.

America is so divided that I am afraid we are advancing toward a sectarian society. The news media and close-minded republicans have done their best to paint democrats as the scum of the earth and un-American.  If this were the 50's the democrats would be labeled as communists and McCarthy would be on our trail.  I don't discuss politics with friends for fear of losing them.

So, I think munsey simply was the catalyst that started a chain reaction for  peoples pent up emotions to surface.  I think the part of his blog that basically said good riddance to Uncle Rich is what sent me over the edge.  Everyone regardless of their ideas should be welcomed on a blog, as long as they are civil.  

Islander,

There are more than a few people out there who get big bucks to say what you said so eloquently.  Think @ a career change, why don't you?  There are also a heck of a lot of Americans, myself included who have agreed with you.  What's the problem?  The middle portion of Americans, the moderates, be they democrats, republicans or independents, are not as well organized or as well funded as the extremists.  That's a big part of it.  When was the last time you either saw of heard a tv/radio show with moderates?

Instead, we have politicians & religious leaders doing their best, & for the most part, succeeding, in scaring the hell out of the populace with hyperbole, outright lies & threats about their futures.  How do they get away with it?  Two basic reasons.  An apathetic public combined with those who refuse to put their respective thinking caps on & a lot of practice knowing that for far too long, the voting public has had to make a choice of the lesser of two evils.  That's rather simplistic, but I think it accurate.  I'm sure we'll have others who will contribute more.

In case you hadn't noticed, we ARE pretty much a sectarian country.  The only thing missing is the writing that makes it official & the laws to enforce it.  Contrary to the lies put out by the extremists, agnostics & people of moderate religious views, any religion at all, were not responsible for things like the inquisition, witch burning, sharia law & a # of other reprehensible acts.  Contrary to the lies put out by some, we don't want to remove any god from the public view.  We just don't want to be forced to pay for it & we don't want the government sponsoring it.  Not our original idea.  You have to back to the signing of the constitution & before to give those good people credit.

We are not trying to take prayer out of schools.  We just don't want to have the govenrnment sponsoring it.  Do we want a secular society?  Absolutely.  That is the only way that every person, regardless of their religious viewpoint, is guaranteed that they will indeed have the freedom to worship the way they wish, think the way they wish & raise their children the way they wish.  History has shown that to be true.  Seen any agnostics or atheists trying to prohibit religious services in any church, religious school, mosque, temple or religious activity?  Nope.  Not one, unless some how it is violating the First Amendment.

I have to admit that some of the reactions against smuncey were unwarranted & quite unlike the way we have usually behaved.  I hope that we can learn from it, change, chalk it up to a big Mulligan & move on.  Whatever our private thought may be, restraint should be used if we hope that people will respect our views.  JATFUR.

RichK

If nothing else, Steve is uniting the divided.  Welcome back Islander and Rich and Winn and your various aka's.

Boring?  Hardly.  It's why I've been an avid reader since way back when.

Thanks, Bill 

Welcome back.  I will honestly say, I enjoy your blogs along with Baxley, Marsha, lillyslore, and winn. You guys hang in there when the others fade!  Oops, I also miss Marsha, who keeps me from writing anything down on paper for fear it is a public record somewhere!!!

I sometimes think I just don't belong anywhere in America today.  I don't completely agree with either of the political agendas.  I deplore my local government, and I believe there are just too many people in Clay county.  

I do enjoy all your blogs.   You guys hang in there.  You keep your soapbox ready, and you always state what is on your mind.  Sigh.  I am just so tired of people who just are zombies, like the people in line at Walmart. They don't like the line, they don't like the selection, but they put up with all that because of the low prices.

I honestly don't think our local governmental guys, are in touch with what concerns me anymore.  I would have to say the same thing for my elected state and federal elected ones either.  What happened to common sense?  It seems to have left the planet.  What is wrong with moderation?  Why do people have to be so polarized?  Why is blue right, and red wrong?  I guess I am just sick of the direction in which our country seems to be headed.

I think our country is like a freight train without an engineer.  It seems to be going full speed down the tracks and no switch in sight.  We seem adrift from common sense.  We velue things instead of people.  He who dies with the most toys wins.  I know, I sound like a worn out record, or in todays world, a scratched DVD.

I enjoy all your posts.  I don't have to agree with them to enjoy them.  They give my brain food for thought.  I look at the 193 visitors online, and I wonder why they have nothing to say; is it because they are like sheep, ready willing and able to be sheared and sent to be slaughtered?  Where are their dreams, their woes, and their joys?

Geez, I seem melancholy, but maybe melancholy is how I feel right now.  Humor me, and give me a a swift kick in the behind!

Stuck on the Island, working for health care

The Islander says farewell for this evening!

This has turned into quite a thread this week.  It started out as a confessional and farewell speech, took a turn towards acting in a manner that Jesus would not do. Next it curves towards telling us all we're boring, and then it gets really vicious for a bit, and next we're not boring because there appears to be a cyber cat fight going on.  I would rather be bored then read mean and spiteful words.  We have discovered that even among the bloggers there is covert activity with regards to identity so we now all have to wonder unless we know who we're speaking to on a personal level they may be speaking from one or more voices who may or may not agree with what the other voice says. 

SMunsey loves to stir the pot, and bait the hooks, his fishing is always good here and I imagine he gets alot of chuckles from it. 

We have alot of problems in this Country, and in this County, but compared to the suffering of people in other parts of the world like Bangladesh to mention only one our problems don't seem so bad.  But, rather then looking for what unites us then what divides us we are feeding a cycle that only the corrupt benefit from. 

I remember when my children were toddlers, the minute Mom got on the phone, or went to the laundry room to fold clothes or got into a intense discussion with their Dad that is when they would get into mischief....everytime.  While we're so involved in debating and arguing and being so distracted over what the hen house needs to be secure and efficient the fox carries out his agenda right under our noses. 

It's easy to be negative, in thought or in deed.  It's easier to place blame then find a solution....for anything. 

Islander I don't really understand your reference to me in your last entry so I don't know whether it is merely an observation, a compliment, something negative, or you have me confused with someone else. 

United we stand, divided we fall and we become more divided each day.  I feel it is very possible that the end of democracy could be seen in my lifetime.  I feel it is very possible that life sustaining water may become more valuable then oil in my lifetime because we're runnning out of it.   I feel our own goverment both local and federal and taking steps to change the laws so that the corrupt can take a death hold on our communities and our nation by changing laws that make it harder and harder for a group of average citizens to change anything.

I came to this blogging community looking to connect to my fellow citizens, I try to check my ego on the front page before I enter the blogs so I don't become part of the problem.  I put my own name and my own face forward in the hopes that people who read what I have to say will know that at the very least I am sincere, and I learn something new everyday about how powerful words are and to seperate what I know from what I think and make them both clear.  I try very hard to be tolerant of other peoples views unless they're just being mean, that I have little tolerance for. 

"Think of your fellow man, lend him a helping hand, put a little love in your heart." I believe Dusty Springfield sung those lyrics.  Maxie is doing it, Mike is doing it and for all of you out there who believe I am a tired old record because I believe people ought to be decent to each other that's just fine because the basics are STILL important.  If you can't state how you feel or what you believe without slamming someone in the process then you have a weak argument and you need to put some more thought into it.

In closing, Islander melancholy is something we all contend with so you're not alone.  It is sometimes caused by physical chemistry or something you've put into your body and sometimes it's caused by losing focus on the life you've been given rather then the life that you make.  When I get down I count my blessings, I think of all the suffering in the world, and I think of all of the places where the freedom and equality don't even exist and it puts things in perspective and the melancholy normally passes.

The one really important lesson I have learned in life....."Whether you are happy and at peace, or miserable and tormented.....hold on because it's going to change"

I'm sorry, but as the resident minutiae obsessive compulsive, I have to address the song lyrics you quoted. It's not Dusty Springfield, an extremely gifted singer and a personal favorite. It was Jackie De Shannon who recorded Put A Litlle Love In Your Heart.

I also agree wholeheartedly with your observation about Islander. I think the melancholy that shines through in the writing is pretty obvious and may be that of someone fighting depression. (Another subject I know more about than I care to.) If therapy is not in Islander's immediate future, I highly recommend comedy novels by Christopher Moore, Carl Hiaasen amd Donald E. Westlake. These always bring a smile to my face when I am down.  Refrences for hilaious novels will be given on request.

Lily's Lore "I don't ever want to be rescued And I don't ever want to be saved I got a feelin' that I'm gonna be alive forever Dancin' on the edge of a grave..." Jim Steinman

Marsha - you are right, what a Long & Winding Road (Beatles, right Lily?).  I've been on vacation this week and spent some time reading the blog site.  I'm glad to be participating, and still trying to figure the whole thing out.  It's interesting to me that it has as much "life" to it as it does.  What attracts us to it?  Why do we keep coming back day after day and spending so much time with each other?  Pretty intriguing.  Blogs are not really new at this point, but I'm still surprised at how much I enjoy this site.

Marsha, you are so right about being sincere.  If we're not going to be sincere, why bother.

Thanks to all who hang out here on The Sun.  See ya soon.

Bill Garrison

Marsha,

How right you are in pointing out how this thread has change.  I can understand how any one can be depressed over the many things that smack us up side the head on a daily basis just as I can understand how another person might be upbeat in the same circumstances.

Watching the Republican debates last night, it seemed like the same emotional/intellectual roller coaster ride I had while watching the Democratic debates. I feel that it will be a never ending circle.  To add injury to insult, this morning I came across a news article stating that in our state of Florida, according to census figures, we have almost 30% of our population that are illegal.  Just thinking about the many negative impacts makes me want to take a stiff drink & it's only 10:40 in the AM.  JATFUR.

RichK

Marsha, your third statement was correct, I did write the wrong blogger's name, but I am not confused.  It is Angela and not Marsha who is the public record person.

Depression, melancholia and yearning for the good old days.  I guess I am a bit well, not depressed about the lack of concern for others that most people have today.  We talk a great game, but we fail to deliver when we are needed in many cases.

I somtimes think I was born about 30 years too late.  I yearn for a simpler less tense time in America.  When people had the time to get to know their neighbors, and the neighbors weren't mostly psychotic.  Sorry, but I calls em as I sees em.  On the island, I have some neighbors that would make Freud take a sabbatical.  I have the drug crazed accident victim, the red neck with a butcher knife, the obsessive-compulsive hoarder, the renter, and the absentee landlord all on my cul-de-sac.  I won't even to to the other end of the street.  Do these neighbors depress me, no, but they sure entertain me.  But it is hard to maintain any kind of neighborly relationship with them.  I talk to people at work, and they all seem to have the same kind of neighborhood, no matter what the price, or how exclusive the neighborhood is.

Maybe I am a bit depressed/angry because I can't retire after 35 years of civil service becaue I can't afford health insurance on my retirement.  Maybe I should just do what everyone else does, just show up at the ER for a common cold, and tell them to bill me.  I never expected a free ride because I gave up hitchhiking before it became unsafe.  I will survive and make the most of it as most people do.

I am just sort of sick and tired of the way that people treat each other.  I guess it makes me sad.  I enjoy the blogs for one reason, I can be myself without fear of real retribution.  The kind that can cost you a job or a career.

Keep up the good work!  I really enjoy reading most blogs.

I guess I am about 5000 years too late.  I would have certainly enjoyed being a Pharoah.  So let it be written, so let it be done.  But it would have been a bit depressing watching all those slaves building my crypt every day of my life!

Rich, I hope you stay with us!  Period. 

From the island - Goodday!